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Big huge giant discussion/turning point in my life and such
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Anon_177415 posted:
You're probably tired of hearing about me, lol. Just wanna share this for y'all who wrote such encouraging things to me.

I'd said that I was gonna wait til next week to talk about marriage counseling, cuz of the wedding going on this weekend.

But the opportunity to bring it up came yesterday.
My husband and I went the mall to p/u his tux for the wedding, we also had to get a gift. Then we had to go grocery shopping and at the same time I was getting some food for the wedding party bcuz we would be going non-stop from 6am to 9pm.
I always set aside giving money (sorta like tithe) so I used it to get the wedding food, cuz her mom was gonna get it but she had a stroke last week. (Plz keep her in your thoughts/prayers.)

While he got his tux I went to pick out a gift. He met me there and said I should get the gift cuz he was getting groceries. Don't know if that's a fair trade but it stressed me cuz even though it wasn't too expensive I don't have that kind of money.

He always wants to buy the cheapest groceries possible, so we usually go to 2 stores. He always acts like this is my fault and complained the whole time.
When he's that mad about the stuff I was getting even though I was getting the healthiest cheap food I can, I freak out inside. I was near tears and shaking. I had a grocery list but I still kept forgetting stuff or my mind would go blank cuz I was so afraid.
We got a lot of groceries cuz we hadn't been shopping in a few weeks and I 'd run out of my food for lunches (been starving all week ). He was so mad at how expensive the total was but I tried to explain that's what happens when we don't buy groceries for a long time and run out of food. Also I bought groceries the last time but I didn't bring that up.


When we got home he sat me down and told me he was sorry he was so grumpy all night but he's going through some stuff and he didn't want to say what kind of stuff cuz it's his own private issue, he just needed my support during this time.

That's about the time I realized I've HAD IT.
I told him it's completely unfair that I'm just supposed to be "supportive" and take the kind of emotional abuse that happens whenever he's "struggling". I'm sick of the cycle, him being horrible to me when he's struggling and then apologizing and saying he's gonna change/read his Bible more and it lasts a week and then he goes back to treating me like crap again.
I said it's on me that I didn't show as much emotional pain as I was feeling cuz I was trying to be supportive/respectful of him. But what he's struggling with kills my self-esteem and the way he treats me is unacceptable. I'm giving him my respect and not getting any back. His treatment of me is getting worse and I'm afraid of him. So afraid that I was scared while grocery shopping, I've stopped asking for things I need, etc.
I apologized cuz I had told a lie, and that's that I'm excited about our vacation. I'm not, I'm scared.

It's like I'm an annoyance to him. I asked why he had wanted to get married, esp when he still loves his fam more?
He blew up about that cuz he always defends his fam so I said let's save that discussion cuz it won't get us anywhere right now. What we need is marriage counseling and we need to start next week. He said ok.
At the end he said "Well, it really hurts to know you don't believe I can change."
I said "I believe you can change, I don't believe you will. I hope you will. I'm saying all this cuz I love you and I'm not helping either of us by letting you hurt me."
He said "Ok well I'm tired I wanna go to sleep."
I said "You're gonna end this discussion cuz you wanna sleep? I just poured my heart out to you and you're mad it kept you up? DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT FEELS LIKE TO HAVE THE PERSON YOU LOVE MORE THAN ANYTHING IN THE WORLD TREAT YOU LIKE ****?"
He was shocked and said he's sorry, he loves me and doesn't want to lose me. He now sees we really need marriage counseling. It ended well.

I owe my courage to you guys. Couldn't have done this w/o you. <3
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MissCaptainKirk responded:
This is MissCaptainKirk btw, didn't mean to post it on anon! Musta checked the wrong box
 
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Aqua14 replied to MissCaptainKirk's response:
Wow. Yay -- good for you! That took a lot of courage to say all that. You're really a lot stronger than you think you are.

<<sending you supportive thoughts to get you through this>>

Judy
 
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cjh1203 responded:
That's really great, MCK -- I know that didn't come easily to you at all and it took a great deal of courage. I'm so glad you got it all out in the open, and will be interested to see what happens now. No matter how things turn out, this really is a huge, giant thing, and a big step in taking control of your life and future. I can't tell you how thrilled I am for you!

I also can't tell you how gratifying it is to hear that coming to this board really has made a difference in your life. We don't hear that very often and there's just no better feeling.
 
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MissCaptainKirk replied to Aqua14's response:
Thanks, I'm accepting those supportive thoughts.
 
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MissCaptainKirk replied to cjh1203's response:
I left a bunch of stuff out, that conversation took like 2 hrs.
It took a lot out of me. Right now I'm still trying to deal with fear, low self-esteem, and what is or isn't ok in our relationship.
I'm having a hard time being around him, and I found out this morning he threw some of my stuff away yesterday. He was not working and home all day while I was at work. I'm kinda mad but after that huge talk last night I feel like constantly bringing stuff up like that is gonna seem nitpicky.

I'm staying over with my friend the (one getting married) tonight. There will still be a part of me that worries about what he's doing...it gives me a stomachache... Plz keep sending the supportive thoughts. Oh and we're going over to his parents' house Sun so pray I don't lose my mind, lol.

All of you are great and special to me. I may not know y'all personally but I still care for you guys. I'll keep posting, I'm pretty sure I'll have questions for a while.

<3
 
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cjh1203 replied to MissCaptainKirk's response:
He threw away some of your stuff??? I would be more than "kinda" mad -- I'd be completely furious. That is absolutely not nitpicky. He has no right at all to throw away things that belong to you, and I can't imagine that he would think it was OK if you threw away his things.

I hope you have a great time tonight.

Can you use your new-found bravery to tell him you aren't going to his parents on Sunday?
 
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MissCaptainKirk replied to cjh1203's response:
Oh he's thrown away some of my stuff before, and I told him it isn't right for him to do that. He thinks I have too much stuff though and that's how he justifies it. "Too much stuff" being less stuff than he has but things he considers unimportant. I'm still upset cuz he destroyed my late grandpa's coffee table I inherited. :_(

Thank you, I'm sure I will have fun and try to keep those thoughts out of my head.

I think my brand new bravery is not brave enough to refuse to go to his parents'. Acutally, I've tried to find other legitimate reasons/activities to not go but the whole family got offended and I got in HUGE trouble. It's gonna take while to address the family thing. Our marriage counselor is have the challenge of their career workin on that one.
 
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naggingwife74 replied to MissCaptainKirk's response:
I can't offer you better advice then you have already gotten and I do have to agree that last night was a great step for you.

However, I have to say that you saying you got in huge trouble for something, really bothered me. You are a grown woman. The only people you can be in trouble with are your parents (no matter how old you are is what my mom tells me!) and the police. Other then that, people can be mad, disappointed and upset with you. But, you should never be in trouble as a grown adult. You have got to start seeing yourself as a grown woman with a life that you are in control of. Sometimes I read your posts and they remind me of how my dad made me feel when I was a teenager. I would hate to think that is how you feel with your husband.
 
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alaska_mommy responded:
Something I wondered, is why it got you so scared when he disapproved of what you were buying at the grocery store. What was at the core of that fear?

Also GOOD JOB for standing up and saying your say. And no, it's not just being "nitpicky" to be upset he threw your things out. Sounds like you don't even have anything that you can reasonably part with, you need every thing you have because you aren't allowed to buy the things you need. Why the heck would he throw out anything of yours?

Also, here's the thought that came to me when you said he ended the conversation because he was tired, then you gave him heck for that, and he acted shocked and sorry. My thought is, he wasn't sorry he made you feel that way. He was just sorry he got called out on it. He's just shocked that it bothered you and you made a stink about it. I'm glad you were able to shock him though, and I think you need to be prepared to feel very nitpicky---you have been letting a TON of crap just slide by unnoticed that he's been doing. So drawing a line and saying, "no more" is going to mean you expressing a LOT of unhappiness with his actions. It may feel nitpicky, but it is actually just you re-writing the boundaries. Sometimes parents have to do this with their kids when they realize they have been letting their kids get away with bad behavior.

The second-best way to deal with it, IMO, short of leaving (which I think you understand is all of our best hopes for you), is to sit him down and spell out the rules for him. Explain to him that his behavior has been unacceptable and that you are not going to tolerate it any longer. If need be, write out a list of rules of what is and is not OK. Then, when he crosses the line, call him out on it--and be firm in not tolerating it.

I understand that may be too difficult right now--but I think it would help a lot if you could get to that point.
 
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tmlmtlrl replied to MissCaptainKirk's response:
Am I the only one that caught this: " I'm still upset cuz he destroyed my late grandpa's coffee table I inherited. :_("

Was that recently or in the past? How did he destroy it?

I guess my biggest issue with you two staying together is that you still really don't understand that you are your own person. YOU are the only one that should be making final decisions about you, what you do, and what happens to your stuff. You are an individual to be loved and respected.

Your life and decisions are not up to him!! Or his family.

You show him respect that he hasn't earned. The sad thing is that he is good at what he does. And what that means is that he will be able to BS his way through most of this counseling. He knows how to fake it to get what he wants.

What's required of him is to be a sincere individual and have empathy for his wife. I don't think he is capable of either of those things. I'm sorry. I wish you could see the big picture that others see and just be on with your life. Start a new beginning where you matter...

Again, you can love someone and not be with them. Reread!!

Good luck! I hope you've had a great weekend at the wedding
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results.
 
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tmlmtlrl replied to tmlmtlrl's response:
Plus....working on your marriage is one thing, but to think that somehow it's going to work to change his whole family dynamic is bordering on crazy talk!!
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results.
 
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cjh1203 replied to tmlmtlrl's response:
No, you aren't the only one who caught the sentence about the coffee table. I was horrified when I read that. That would have been the end of the marriage for me. I don't know how anyone could forgive that (or most of the other things -- but especially that).
 
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fcl responded:
I think it's great that you did this - it was long overdue - but ... please realize that this is just the very first step. The rest of the road will be long and hard.

So many things struck me in your post that I hardly know where to start ...

"When he's that mad about the stuff I was getting even though I was getting the healthiest cheap food I can, I freak out inside. I was near tears and shaking. I had a grocery list but I still kept forgetting stuff or my mind would go blank cuz I was so afraid."

"His treatment of me is getting worse and I'm afraid of him"

"I'm excited about our vacation. I'm not, I'm scared."

Areyoui sure you love this man? He scares you senseless.

Please go and talk to the people at the local women's shelter. You don't have to move in there just go and talk to them. They'll have the best advice for you. It would also help you to have people that you can go to that know about your situation, people who will listen, peole that don't need an appointment to see ...

You HAVE to stop "asking " for things. You are both working, you are both earning. He is not your father and you a little girl who has to ask because she has no money. When you're out shopping, you just put what you need in your trolley. If he asks what you did that for that is your cue to ask him loudly (loud enough to be heard in the next aisle) what kind of man grudges his wife tampons?

I'm very proud of what you've done. Now go and enjoy that wedding!
There's nothing inherently dirty about sex, but if you try real hard and use your imagination you can overcome that.
 
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Spankyrae replied to MissCaptainKirk's response:
Congratulations on your first big step of independence. Every little or large step towards this helps. I also agree that this is just the beginning, and honestly, I wouldn't even get my hopes up about him agreeing to go to counseling. Shoot, he pitched some of your belongings just after this talk you guys had.

For him, the real proof will be when he goes to counseling consistently, when he actively does better and when you can see obvious proof of this. If he is willing to change and stop the abuse and control, it's going to take a while for this to happen. There's probably years of programming and conditioning that have led him to this, plus the apparent connection between abuse and addiction.

Same thing for you also. It's going to take some time, some tears, some conflict, and some hard work for you to undo the programming. You're facing a cycle of control that apparently stemmed from your parents, I think you mentioned a previous mate who was abusive also and now your husband. From the things you post, it sounds like you have been brainwashed quite effectively.

BUT... please know that it is very, very possible for you to undo it. In your words, I hear that you are willing to break this cycle and I truly hope you do. You have all the strength you need, and continuing counseling on your own will help a great deal. You deserve to be treated well by yourself and others.

I think I would just keep the goal right now of making yourself healthy, so you aren't attached to the hope of him doing the same. And I agree with others that this means leaving him---even if just temporarily. I know you said you don't think he'd hit you, but I think there's a great chance he would. In his mind, harming you physically may be effective if he sees his control tactics are not working anymore or as much.
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