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Dr Sinatra
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jc3737 posted:
I spoke with Dr Stephen Sinatra and asked him about The China Study and the work of Dr Esselstyn.Here is his reply:

Every strict vegetarian (vegan) I've examined has had low blood levels of CoQ10, L. carnitine , alpha lipoic acid and vitamin B12. These are critical nutrients found most abundantly in animal protein. You can try to compensate for these missing nutrients through supplementation , and I would strongly recommend that if you're firmly wed to being on a strict, healthy vegetarian diet. But I would not switch to becoming a vegetarian based on The China Study.

I researched international cuisine for many years and came to the conclusion that the best diet on the planet is what I call a Pan-Asian Mediterranean diet . That's what I eat, and I recommend it to my patients. Asian and Mediterranean cultures enjoy fish and smaller quantities of meat, root vegetables and fresh local fruits and greens. They also frequently use meat to flavor their sauces.

As for myself, I follow an 80-20 rule. I eat 80 percent vegetarian foods, and 20 percent meat—including lamb, buffalo, salmon and chicken. I also eat a lot of organic vegetables, fruit, eggs, yogurt and some cheese on a day-to-day basis, and I use organic milk on cereals.
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max9821 responded:
A retired board certified cardiologist who, much like Atkins, also a cardiologist, poo poos cholesterol as being involved in heart and artery disease, who engages in some kind of psychological healing therapy, who sells an extensive line of vitamins and supplements. Has told at least one of his patients to eat all the eggs he wanted to raise his ldl and by golly it worked. The man was taking statins which caused cognitive difficulties. I believe he went off his statins and improved but Sinatra attributes this to the eggs and rising ldl.

His patients are different from other people. They seem to get heart attacks with cholesterol levels of 130 while only about 6 people in the massive Framingham study had heart disease with numbers under 150. Esselstyn reports 0.5% of patients had heart events out of almost 200 on his latest study. But for some reason, Sinatra sees many.

Evidently the vegans he examined do not know about B12 supplements or fortified foods and Sinatra has found them low in Coq10, a supplement which he happens to sell. The fact that a miniscule number of people in this country are vegans and are among the healthiest, thinnest and longest lived people and yet Sinatra has found them lacking in --uh oh--supplements that he sells, makes one ask, who are these people and where does he find them all and how did this very small number find their unhealthy way to Sinatra. Of course, he does not say whether they are whole food, plant based, low fat vegans or are of the potato chip and coke variety. In which case they need more than Sinatra's supplements.

I might also add that Sinatra appears to have the same physique as the late dr. Atkins. Not exactly slim.

dolores
 
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jc3737 replied to max9821's response:
I'm not happy that he sells stuff but then doesn't everyone including Drs Fuhrman and McDougall.

Psychological healing therapy? Where did you get this info?

Heart attacks with low cholesterol levels.I have known several friends that happended to including one whose TC level was 130....so thats one area I know from first hand observation gets greatly exaggerated...people with low cholesterol do have heart attacks and its not an uncommon thing unless it just so happens I have known a number of the unluckiest people on the planet.

I asked Dr Sinatra several questions about the success of Dr Esselstyn and his peer reviewed study but he did not respond except to say he had read the China Study and knew of Dr E work.

I have seen Dr Sinatra on the Dr Becker TV show and he does not appear fat but just of average build,not real trim like Dr Campbell or Dr Essee....more like Dr McDougall....but not like Dr Atkins who was downright fat.
 
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max9821 replied to jc3737's response:
http://www.drpasswater.com/nutrition_library/2013_Sinatra_CHolesterol_Myth.html

Here is one write up about dr. sinatra. You will read that he uses some kind of psychoenergetic healing. I don't know how different this is from Ornish's yoga and meditation. This article was written by someone who admires dr. sinatra.

Of all the diet gurus, McDougall's whole program can be found for free on his website. You really need nothing but what you read there. If you want to pay for his live in program, buy his books or dvd's you can but I personally do not think you will get anything you can't get on his site if it is information you are looking for. He does not sell supplements like fuhrman or sinatra. He did lend his name to food packages but he says he is no longer involved in that. I do not know what this means. The point is, no matter what he is selling, he does not say they are needed to have a healthy diet. Sinatra on the other hand does go on about the need for co q 10 which he just happens to sell. And maybe some other things. I just am not that familiar with his products. Same with fuhrman.

Plant Positive talks about reverse causation. Sick people might have low cholesterol because they are sick. You will have to check in with plantpositive for that information. Yes it is strange that a study lasting over at least a generation found very few with cholesterol under 150 who had heart disease out of thousands of participants but of your acquaintance the percentage seems to be very high. I can't explain it.

I also am not sure about whether or not sinatra debunks the cholesterol/heart connection.

The Becker show. Their whole program is an advertisement for the supplements and noni juice and other items they sell.

dolores
 
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jc3737 replied to max9821's response:
I agree about the Becker show...and he is downright wrong a good bit of the time.But he does have some good guests on from time to time.Thats the only time I watch.

Dr McDougall is much less commercial than most of the doctors but is still making a good living from books,retreats,etc

Dr Sinatra does debunk the cholesterol theory but still beleives in the high blood pressure and high glucose theory... as well as the Easter Bunny.

I told him a diet that greatly increases ppotassium like the MCDougall diet will lower bood pressure and blood glucose drastically.He did not respond but he also did not kick me off the site or remove my post....maybe he does believe in the scientific method after all.


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